Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial After having over a week to read over a lot of the old post, I have a feeling I know how this is going to go. But let's put it out there anyway.
Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial - Who would win in a fight?
just kidding.
Which ministry/radio show do you prefer and why?
*Hey how come the option to post polls is turned off?*
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial Personally I'm going to go with Crown Financial.
Firstly, I found them first, Ramsey is only just now starting to get popular in my area, I found crown over two years ago, and they got me starting on getting out of debt and on the right path
Secondly, They have tons of free resources. They have all sorts of forms on there website for financial planning, and tons of articles on every subject under the sun. they even have to ability to chat online 24 hours a day with a trained counsellor to help you talk about your situation, free.
They have been around for a long time though, and I think they are losing popularity. Of course Larry Burkette passed away a few years ago. He was he host for a long time, and was brilliant. They had Howard Dayton on for a while, and now Chuck Bentley, who is doing a pretty good job in my opinion.
Also I greatly disagree with about the Real Estate market, as discussed in another thread, I think his Background taints his opinion.
I do have to give Dave the edge for entertainment though. His show is much more entertaining. He's just funny, and we all like it when he calls people stupid :P But I listen to both podcast. Crown is neat becuase they are always interviewing different people and every show is new and different. After listening to Dave for over a month, it's still entertaining, but it's a bit repetitive with the same stupid people asking the same stupid questions. Seriously, we all know how Dave is going to answer every single question.
Dave is getting really popular though, and I do like the idea of his Financial Peace University being one day a week for so many weeks, versus crown has a one day all day Saturday class. I was signed up for the crown class, it got cancelled, I might just do FPU instead, I just need to be able to commit the time. And Dave does have the Fox show, I haven't seen it yet, but it's awesome he's on Tv, I'm going to start DVR'ing it, so I can catch it sometime.
The reason I thought of this topic, is on yesterdays showed, Dave mentioned not interviewing people becuase he didn't need to in order to fill up time on his show. I just compared that to crown in my head.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial i guess it depends on what exactly we are comparing between the two:
Get out of/stay out of debt advice?
Use or abuse of credit/borrowing?
Investing advice?
Real estate advice?
Use of biblical principles to support their recommendations?
Entertainment value?
I do not know Crown Financial inside and out so i am not aware of where they disagree with Dave. Perhaps you can spell out their differences for us to examine them more closely.
"People don't care how much you know, until they know how much you care" - GKC
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial The question is general, so you can answer any way you like. If you listen to Dave and not Crown, then it is safe to say "I prefer Dave, I listen to him not crown" It's not saying that one is bad and the other is good. I would encourage everyone to listen to both.
Honestly as far as what they teach, there are not many differences at all. The Dave Ramsey Baby Steps is almost identical to the Crown Money Map. Step 1, start a budget, save $1000, Step 2, Pay off all Credit Cards and raise savings to one month living expenses. etc. (makes me wonder which one came first?)
I have found two differences that they teach consistantly. Dave Ramsey is adimant about your house costing 25% of your take home on a 15 year mortage. Crown generally says 36% of your take home, and it's been a while since I've heard them talk about it, but I don't ever remembering them saying a 30 year mortgage is a bad thing. They've said that 15yr is better, and they talk alot about how paying off the house early is a good thing (it's part of their money map) but Dave is Adament about 25% at 15yr. So that is difference number one.
Number two is College loans. Crown on really ever considers going into debt for two reasons, one to own a home, and two to go to college, when it will increase your potential income. But then they come right behind by saying you should work to pay off all debt as quickly as possible. I seem to remember Dave saying that getting a student loan was always a bad idea. Perhaps I'm confusing it with one particular caller he had.
Other then that, they teach pretty much the same stuff. The radio Shows are completely different. Dave Answers calls for an hour and is funny. Money Life, is 30 minutes, and can be different everyday. Sometimes they interview people on differnent subject, sometimes they answer questions, sometimes they just talk about a certain topic. Here I'll give you latest 10 podcast titles
Chuck Bentley teaching on "Children and Money"
Ron Blue on "Turning Fear into Faith"
Chuck Bently teaches about Godly Mothers in the Bible
Chuck Bentley with Money Saving Tips
Listener Testomonies
Chuck Bentley answers your questions
David Szafranski Founder of Edgewater Investment Groups
Chuck Bentley on the Purpose of money 1kings 18
Chuck Bently on hope for the future jeremiah 29
Preparing for financial uncertainity.
It's very family friendly, no one gets called "Stupid" lol. It would be a G rating where Dave Ramsey is like a PG rating.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial Thanks for the recap on Crown. Obviously i can't comment that i "prefer" one since i have never listened to Crown, but i will say this about Dave:
i pretty much agree with almost everything he says about how to get out of debt, budgeting, max spend on cars, etc.
I disagree with him on the following:
1) i do believe maintaining a credit (FICO) score is important and i believe one can do so without "worshiping at the altar of the almighty FICO" and thus if i use my credit cards and pay off the balance every month (ie. don't pay ANY interest), i can take advantage of the rewards associated.
2) i don't believe in prepaying your mortgage unless you literally have money flowing out of your ears (it is similar to pouring all your money into one stock without diversification).
3) i don't agree with his investment philosophy of using actively managed mutual funds based on their 10+year performance record since 1) i don't believe in active management, 2) i don't believe past performance is a good indicator of future success, and 3) i don't believe in investing in loaded-mutual funds (my understanding is he recommends American funds some of which are front-loaded). i would advocate passive investing based on low-expense ratios, diversification across domestic/international, large-cap/small-cap, equity/fixed income, long-term outlook, maintaining good asset allocation and regular rebalancing.
4) i am more neutral towards whole life insurance than DR (who HATES them), although i wouldn't say i'm really all that for them either.
"People don't care how much you know, until they know how much you care" - GKC
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial Oh yeah, I forgot credit cards.
Crown advocates using them carefully for the rewards. Paying them off in full every month. But tells people who have not already established good spending habits to cut them up. So they are more like you. Honestly, I more agree with Dave, I think they are evil, and I don't want to support them. But the one guy on crown, I think his name is Dave Ball, he was talking about the credit card he uses everyday, and his reward points actually get applied to paying down the principle balance on his mortgage, they actually write a check to his mortgage company every month! I thought that was really cool.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial All i can say is that my wife and i got >$800+ worth of cash rebates, gift card redemptions, etc. from the credit cards we used last year. Most of it came from regular spending on things like gas, groceries, pharmacy prescriptions/OTC meds, doctor bills, etc (things i would've spent money on regardless of whether i put it on credit cards or not). The way i see it is if i'm basically being GIVEN $800 by the credit cards companies for spending that i'm already doing, i'll take it!
"People don't care how much you know, until they know how much you care" - GKC
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial We are having the crown seminar here and I'm looking forward to it. The training center here in Slovakia is offering the Crown Seminar for 27 Euros, that includes meals and a place to stay here Friday night before. I'm sorry but $900 for a money management class is not realistic for my husband and I. That is almost equal to our monthly salary!
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial Originally Posted by Stasigh
Wow that is a big difference. The Crown class sounds like a steal if it includes a room too!! A Euro is still about 2 American dollars right? That's the same price I would pay, and it doesn't include any food or a place to stay.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial I have had the opportunity to go through and lead both Crown and FPU. Both are GREAT programs and are different. Kind of like comparing apples to oranges. Crown is a Bible study with practicle how to advice "thrown in" and FPU is mostly practicle advice with Biblical application "thrown in". I am preparing to lead a financial stewardship Bible study at my church using the Crown Bible study material and one of the FPU videos every fouth week as a social and pot luck night with Dave as the entertainment. The key difference with these two programs is whether you are looking for a BIble study or practicle, common sense financial knowledge. How you answer that question will tell you which program is right for you.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial I have also gone through and lead both Crown and Financial Peace by Dave Ramsey. Like the previous poster said, Crown is bible verses with finance thrown in, while FPU is finance with bible verses thrown in. Both are excellent classes. I like crown for the background of why we do what we do with our money and what God says about finances. It is timeless advise. Dave is an entertainer and motivator. He's fun to watch and listen to. If you want to get more into what the bible says, take Crown. If you need a kick in the pants, take Dave.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial That is the exact same feeling I get just from listening to both radio programs! I really like them both.
I think it is amazing that both of them pretty much come up with the same solutions. If you really look at the seven step process they both lay out, they are really similiar. I think this points to the fact that if you just approach financial matters from a purely secular perspective you will come to the conclusion that success comes from the financial patterns laid out biblically, even if you never know they are in the bible.
I am depressed neither of you shared which one you personally PREFER. I guess you guys feel obligated not to answer, cuase you've done work for both. Bob, you need to turn on the polls, so they can vote anonymously. :P
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial 4jacks,
are you trying to start a fight?
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial I forgot to mention that Chuck Bentley has Dave Ball as like a side kick. Dave acts like he doesn't know much to keep the conversation going and give Chuck a chance to show his expertice.
And it's weird becuase Dave Ball sounds exactly like FRANK MIR the former Mixed Martial Arts heavy weight Title Holder. Who currently does the commentary for the WEC show. But that's the opposite, beucase he's the MMA expert and somebody who doesn't know as much asks him questions about the fight. So I listen to the podcast and hear this guys ask financial question, like he doesn't know anything, then I go home and watch MMA and there he is as the MMA expert. lol
And Chuck would totally wipe the floor with Dave.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial 4jacks,
What part of comparing apples to oranges didn't you understand? Your question is as valid as asking if The New Testament is better than the Old Testament. Again, Crown is a Bible study, FPU is not. I like both of the courses for what they are. If I didn't, I wouldn't use thier material. I will also point out that I have NEVER "done work for" Crown or FPU. I have however used the material they offer to help people learn about Biblical financial stewardship and financial planning.
I will also add that the "purely secular perspective" of financial success is much different than what God describes as financial success in the Bible. If you don't understand the difference between the two different perspectives, may I suggest you take a good Bible study on the issue like Crown.
BTW, an apple grows on an apple tree, and an orange grows on an orange tree. That is a good place to start when you want to learn the difference between the two.
I hope this helps!
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial I prefer Oranges to Apples. Do you understand that?
I completely disagree, but I see what your are saying. I think the world puts out a fake version of how financial success is supposed to be obtained, Credit cards, pay day loans etc. It's all glamorized as much as smoking or junk food. But none of it leads to any form of success.
However, if you follow the financial advice of truely successful secular advisor, you will find a lot of general basics in common with basic biblical principles. Are you familiar with Suze Orman? Not sure if I spelled it right. She is 100% secular, Backed up by Oprah. But she has a lot of good stuff. and he general principles are the same. Diversification, Getting out of debt, etc. The only thing she won't advocate is giving and tithing.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial Actually, Suze Orman definitely advocates giving (if you have money to give), but, not being a Christian, she doesn't limit that giving to tithing.
"People don't care how much you know, until they know how much you care" - GKC
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial Actually, Suze Orman definitely advocates giving (if you have money to give), but, not being a Christian, she doesn't limit that giving to tithing.
touche'
Okay, lemme rephrase that to She'll never admit that God Actual Owns everything.
I didn't know she talked about giving. I have an e-book of hers (free from oprah.com) but I can't bring myself to read it. One of my best friends is a big fan of hers though, and I know she gives great investment advice.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial It is still obvious from your continuous muzing that you need a Crown Bible study because your really don't understand the difference between God's way of managing money and property and the worlds way. But enjoy your oranges!
BTW - I never or will ever quote Suze Orman or Oprah!
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial I don't know who dumped in your cheerios dude, but you need to take it down a notch. If you don't want to answer the simple question, then just pass the thread up, don't come here and get all puffy.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial again, i have to disagree with that statement. personally, i think her get out of debt advice is great (just as dave ramsey's) but it's her investment advice that's lacking. She typically advises to only invest in the stock market with a minimum 10 year horizon (not horrible advice but a bit conservative - 5-7 years may be enough to reap at least some reward). She also advises to invest in low cost ETFs and/or stocks that pay high-yield dividends to help manage through the downturns such as this one (you will continue getting some dividends to offset the equity loss in the stock/fund). the problem with that approach is that dividend stocks often have lousy upside potential plus their dividends can be high one year and off another year (just look at financials this past year - among the highest paying dividend stocks!). I'm not saying one can't do worse, but i still feel like one can do better. interestingly, she doesn't follow her own advice, but i also realize her advice is for the "common folks" out there with average incomes. she herself (with a net worth upwards of $40+ million) invests ~90% in municipal bonds/real estate. She thus earns tax-free interest on these bonds which gives her a steady income (she does seem frugal in her own right relative to the lifestyle of others at her net worth).
"People don't care how much you know, until they know how much you care" - GKC
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial lol, not going to let me slide are you? I fully admit I've never read her stuff or watched her program, I'm just going off what my friend does.
I was just trying to use her as an example of a secular financial advisor, comparable to Dave Ramsey and Crown. To show the similarities in the basic advice that they give.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial 4jacks,
First may I say that I am not "all puffy". Secondly, If you remember, your question was "Which ministry / radio show do you prefer and why?" I answered your question with a easy to understand and valid answer. Could it be that the problem you are having is that the answer points you to God and His word instead of Suze Orman and Oprah? Only you can answer that question.
May I also add that the next time you don't like the answer to your question, don't get "all puffy" with the messenger.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial gary_attack,
You Sir have not read a Single word I've typed in this whole thread!
And the whole Apples and Oranges insult certainly wasn't pointing to Christ.
Maybe you need to go part and read the reply where I completely agreed with your post. I only stated I was depressed that you didn't actually answer the question. This thread was suppose to be one of those questions that makes you compare two things that you don't normally and choose. It's not a serious thread it's just a conversation starter. Let me rephrase the question for you:
You are stuck in a certain place for a certain period of time. You have control of the radio, but you can only set the radio once. Dave Ramsey will be on radio station A and Money Life with Howard Dayton will be on radio station B. You must select a channel, and those are the only two channels. You must listen to the program, you can't break the radio or speakers or stick your fingers in your ear.
Now pick one! Or I'll strap you down and make you watch Oprah non-stop for the rest of your life!
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial 4jacks,
1) My screen name is garyatk. (more evidence that it is not me that is "all puffy")
2) I have read every word you have written in this thread several times. I have also prayerfully considered whether I should respond to you. But since you have misunderstood most of what I have said, I was forced to attempt to clear up some things. I will try again.
3) Your origonal question was "Which ministry / radio show do you prefer and why?' I answered the ministry part in my first post. I did not say anything about the radio shows. I didn't because the radio shows are a by product of the ministry (Dave Ramsey is a for profit enterprise, not a ministry anyway hence the apples and oranges example) (NOT AN INSULT) (An attempt to point out that the difference isn't on the surface, but rather in the foundational principles) (If you took it as an insult, maybe you should look closer at yourself)
4) Maybe you need to go back to the part where you DIDN"T agree with me. I quote "I think this points to the fact that if you just approach financial matters from a purely secular perspective you will come to the conclusion that success comes from the financial patterns laid out biblically". As a Christian brother (I hope) I had to point out the errors in this thinking. And instead of debating it, I suggested that "you take a good Bible study on the issue like Crown".
5) Again, I answered your question. I am sorry if you got "depressed".
6) I don't need you to rephrase the question for me. As I have said several times, I already answered it. I'm sorry if you don't like the answer! But if you want my opinion on the radio shows only, and you don't want to start a new thread, I guess I can answer it here.
It would be like comparing apples to oranges. One is a half hour a day, commercial free, on Christian radio, and is a Christian ministry, and the other is 3 hours a day on secular radio (with commercials) and is a for profit enterprise. The foundational principles of one is for the glory of God, and the other is for profit.
I'm sorry! You don't like the comparing apples to oranges answer. How about grapes to cherries. Either way, I guess it is what you like best.
I hope you don't believe that forcing me to listen to Oprah for the rest of my life is a good way of pointing me or anyone else to Christ because that will start a whole new thread, and I don't think you want to go there!
Again, I hope this helps!
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial I would agree with that statement (see, i'm not out to get you, Patrick!
In regards to gary's point on Dave Ramsey being for profit: it may be a tad harsh to say he is doing it primarily for profit and not for the glory of God. Why can't he do it for both so long as the profit he brings in is also used primarily for the glory of God?
"People don't care how much you know, until they know how much you care" - GKC
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial Is it possible to consider everything that is said by a poster, and not just pull out one phrase and use it out of context?????? I have not been harsh on Dave Ramsey! He is a Christian with a for profit company. I have never met the man and have no idea what he does with his money. He does have GREAT material that I use in the classes I teach. If I didn't like it or him, I wouldn't use it. I also listen to his radio show when I can get it, but I don't pay to get a download. Not because I have a problem with him making money from it, but because I don't value it enough to pay for it. But if you would like to pay for it, go ahead, I have no problem with it. You can also send a tax deductable donation to Crown. I have done it before and they appreciate it very much. But you can't do that for DR. Remember apples and oranges??????? (Didn't mean to offend)
Just let me make this perfectly clear...... I never said that Dave Ramsey runs his company only for a profit or that his company and it's profits are not used to glorify God.
PLEASE READ EVERYTHING POSTED AND STAY ON TOPIC AND IN CONTEXT!
THANK YOU AND I HOPE THIS HELPS!!!!!!
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial gary, i apologize if you think i took your comment out of context. the context is above. it was my interpretation that you were contrasting Crown and Dave Ramsey (DR) in this paragraph. at the end, you pit the "foundational principles" of one being "for the glory of God" and the other "is for profit". Perhaps you intended to say "one is not-for-profit, the other is for-profit". Regardless, I am glad you took the time to clarify, and other readers now can understand what you really meant...but on face value, that's the way i took the statement.
"People don't care how much you know, until they know how much you care" - GKC
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial I have made more than one statement. My other statements could have and should have been used to better understand my intentions. I thought I have been very clear about what I have been saying. But when 2 people have a hard time figuring it out and 1 gets thier feelings hurt, I guess I should either be a little more careful or just not get involved. Then again, I have lead over 100 people through small group studies on this issue and have not had any trouble in the past. So you tell me where the trouble is.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial Gary, are you telling me that you typed this in a non demeaning way?
Can you can HONESTLY say that you typed that and that you did not INTEND to demean me in away?
If you honestly did not mean that in a demeaning way, then you worded it very poorly, but I forgive you and we can move on.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial Hey, i think we agree on something! Or did i take that out of context?
"People don't care how much you know, until they know how much you care" - GKC
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial 4jacks,
Please allow me to go very slow so you can understand. (and if that is demeaning, I am sorry! I am getting very tired of this and yes once again you are looking at one sentence at a time and not even in the order in which they occurred)
To answer your first question, Please go back and read the entire third point again from the post in question. How do you get "demeaning" out of that? I might also add that it may not have been sweet and nice because of how you addressed me previously, but in no way was it "demeaning"!
Ok, now let's address my comment of "What part of comparing apples to oranges didn't you understand?" A valid question! Now keep reading the post! Nothing "demeaning at all! Especially when you totally ignored what I said in my first post, and responded by saying "I am depressed niether of you shared which one you personally PREFER. I guess you guys feel obligated not to answer, cause you've done work for both." My original post pointed out very clearly that the differences in the two programs are as different as apples and oranges and by responding this way, you clearly didn't understand that. It had nothing to do with feeling obligated not to answer cause I've done work for them! I said several times it is because I like and use BOTH programs!
Now lets look at "BTW - an apple grows on an apple tree, and an orange grows on an orange tree. That is a good place to start when you want to learn the difference between the two." Nothing "demeaning" here, just a reference as to why it is important to take a look at the foundational differences between the two programs as stated several times in all my posts! I also believe it was worded very well and YOU did not recieve it well.
I will also add that it was YOU that got " all puffy" with me, not I with you! But I forgive you, and we can move on!
Pochax,
Yes, you took it out of context again, and all I can say is it is obvious that your mother never taught you when to NOT to be a smart a..! Yes, I meant that to be demeaning! SORRY, even I can be pushed too far!
I hope that helps!
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial You are so kind and gracious!
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial I know! I wish you could say the same about yourself! At least I have tried to correct what you misunderstood. You on the other hand never once took responsibility for what you said. But I again forgive you, and we can move on. I guess we are like apples and oranges!
I hope that helps!
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial Gary, I apologize for the stuff I typed that were demeaning. Including calling you "gary attack" Everything was meant to be taken in jest as sarcasm.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial Accepted! When using sarcasm however, it is important to not take what the other person is saying so seriously then. This will help avoid misunderstandings.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial I love Crown. I think they are Biblical, informative and professional, as well as humble. I have limited exposure to Dave Ramsey but to me he seems arrogant. "Do it my way you're stupid" type of attitude. There can be many ways to get control of your money and different people have different priorities. I have a few other opinions but they have already been expressed well here by others.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial Yeah, I got the exact same thing from him, when I first started listening. But after listening for a little bit he really grows on you. You can tell from the way he handles his callers who are going through tough times that he really is a genuinely caring guy. He's just rough around the edges.
Which honestly doesn't really bother me, I've grown up that way.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial Just as there is quality in the various models of top-rated vehicle manufacturers, I think you can say the same for these two organizations. Although there could be philosophical differences here, these two organizations have a lot to offer. Why not consider taking the best from each of them?
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial I have used both Crown and Financial Peace University while getting out of debt, and in my case FPU and Dave's principles were more "real world" and were laid out in a way that my husband and I could see results. I appreciate Crown's Biblical approach and still refer to it occasionally, but IMHO we had more success using Dave's method. We've paid off over $67,000 and are $1500 away from being debt-free except our house!
Any time you try and compare two products like this, you're going to have some who have great results with one, and some have great results with the other! If this weren't true, we'd only have one diet plan, one financial plan, and so on...LOL!
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial Very Nice! Congrats!
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial That's fantastic, Mharpole! I hope to see a post from you in the Success Stories section of these forums when you guys pay of the remaining $1500!Very Nice! Congrats!
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial Okay I heard 2 things today on the 8/05/2009 DR podcast that kinda pushed my buttons.
I'll make a new thread for one (not money related)
But the money related thing, he had a caller who had variable income. Sales or some junk. And wanted advice on how to budget.
His advice was as follows, which he says is also described in a worksheet in the back of the TMMO book, (can someone verify?)
State the minimum you could make
State the maximum you could make
List your debts in order of priority and just pay what you can each month.
I'm sorry but that is crappy advice. That means you could be balling bling bling for 3 months and then bam, you don't pay your student loan, or car loan, or phone bill or whatever. I'm hoping he just plain forgot to talk about a really big step.
Of course Crown Financial talks about it on thier radio program. lol sorry, had to mention that.
But you create a seperate savings account. You budget what you need to live on, and when you are under for a month you draw from the account, and when you are over, you deposit the difference in the account. That way you can SPEND the same amount every month, even though one month you make more or less money. In effect, you don't have random low priority bills that don't get paid every month.
/rant
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial Yeah that one was weird because I don't think he made sure that their minimum covered all their payments. It would be one thing to say that between the base pay and income from the spouse's job they could cover everything so from there it's extra payments, but that didn't seem to be the case.
Re: Dave Ramsey Versus Crown Financial Like the posters above, I think that both Crown and FPU are great. I teach both. I attend and host live events for both. Crown definitely takes a deeper dive into scripture, going 15-20 bible verses deep each week. Crown is a bible study about what God's word says about money and finances; aka stewardship. FPU is a high energy, motivating financial study that is biblically based. FPU is a better outreach tool because some folks that would otherwise never darken the doorway of the church TV. It saddens me because I frequently hear Crown advocates disparage FPU as being less God-honoring. I have never attended at FPU event where Ramsey failed to acknowledge God as the owner of everything and worthy of all honor. Sadly, it comes off as little bit like "little brother syndrome."
Ramsey planted the seed, Crown watered it, (or vice versa) but God made it grow.
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